Conversion of TIVO into MPG

[edsmith77]

Good Morning,

I recently upgraded my cable service to include the HD channels as well as upgrading my old TIVO box to an HD TIVO box. This upgrade I think is at the root of my problems.
In the past, I would download via a TIVO application recorded shows to my base PC. I would then use VideoReDo to convert the TIVO file into an MPG file and then edit with TMPG Express 4. I was perfectly happy with the results. That is until I upgraded to HD. Now I am having conversion problems.

VideoReDo works as it did before. Feed it the .TIVO file and let it convert to .mpg. At this point things are going south. The VideoReDo conversion works as before (I think). However, in some spots TMPG express will hang not only the application but the PC as well with an unrecognized video stream error. This often occurs in 2 or three spots in an hours worth of recording.

I re-ran the .TIVO file thru VideoReDo's quick stream fix, saved and re-edited with the exact same results. Maybe VideoReDo does not work well with HD video streams, I am thinking. So I tried Direct Show Dump (a lot fewer options to use here) but the conversion went OK, but I still get the unrecognized video stream error.

Last nite, I happened to get a slightly different error message. This time the error message said the video frame size has been changed.

Since, the offending frames are in the middle of an advertisement, I though I would set a begin cut marker at the start of the ad. Then skip to the end of the file and sneak up on the end of the ad clip from the back side and insert an end cut marker. Then I could just delete the offending frames. Well, this approach failed, too. It would not set the end cut marker properly. It appears to set properly, but the cut command deletes everything from the start marker to the end of the file. arrrrrgh.

Has anyone else experienced the problem? If so, please share your solution. I am at a dead stop with this problem.

Thanks for your help and advice.

Ed

[Baldrick]

What is the hd tivo details? MPEG2 video with ac3 audio ? Identify with MediaInfo.

And have you tried tytool? Visit http://www.dealdatabase.com/forum/showthread.php?t=47025

[jman98]

VideoReDo works fine with HD video. I record directly from a cable box to my PC via firewire and VideoReDo can edit my HD captures with no problems. In fact I originally bought VideoReDo specifically because I had a lot of problems getting MPEGVCR to work correctly with HD video and VideoReDo could handle it with no problems.

Your editing method is backwards. While it seems intuitive to do it your way, what you need to do for best results is instead mark the video that you want to keep, put that in a clipboard, and then assemble those parts together into a new file. Trying to remove unwanted video from a file instead of creating a new file from the pieces you want to keep can lead to all kinds of weird problems. Unfortunately, nobody tells you that. Try it my way and see if that helps you any.

[edsmith77]

Baldrick,
Thanks for the suggestions and I will try them when I get home this evening. I have no idea what is in the TIVO files. since the structure seems to be proprietary but not so much as others have been able to provide translaters. I think VideoReDo has a business arrangement with TIVO for being able to do conversions. My final video format is MPEG2 and AC3 by using TDA after editing.

Jman98,
I am not certain why you think my editing process is backwards. By marking the pieces that need to be excluded then having the application output a contiguous file (minus the marked pieces) seems to be rather straight forward. Whereas cutting and pasting the numerous and desired segments into a completely different application seems to be the akward method. But it does offer an alternative option and one that may bypass having to deal with these stubborn frames.
I am not certain if VideoReDo will allow a contiguous file of the excluded segments (following your suggestion).

I am not certain about the actual implementation; the problem exists (and VideoReDo is not immune from this problem) when the slider is passed over the bad frames, the application stops. In fact, I ran VideoReDo in is mark out the advertisment mode and it stopped when it got to these frames.

Lastly, I am very interested in how you physically connected your recording setup. Unfortunately, my Happauge only records basic cable channels (not the HD channels). I do have a DVR connected to the Cable Box, but resizing, recoding and the extra effort in getting the DVR recorded video to final state is just not worth the effort. Even the converting the TIVO files over is beginning to run on the ragged edge of worthfullness.

I do appreciate even if I do not fully understand or grasp the suggestions. I will try all suggestions. Even Holy Crap that does work, works for me. :P

Ed

[poisondeathray]

In videoredo options you can select cut mode or scene mode. Cut mode is default. Cut mode is used to remove parts like commercials. Scene mode is used mark areas to keep

In certain versions, you can use either "cut selection" or "trim unselect" depending on what you want (referring to the selection or the unselected part)

For the bad frames, did you try the "quickstream fix" option?

You didn't mention what version you are using either, perhaps you can upgrade?

[jman98]

Your process is backwards, but it's also intuitive. You need to change your thinking - instead of removing what you don't want, cut and join what you do want. Both VideoReDo and MPEGVCR work much better that way. Don't EXCLUDE anything! Here's an example. Let's say I have a TV capture like this:
1 minute intro
2 minutes commercials
10 minutes of show
2 minutes of commercials
11 minutes of show
2 minutes of commercials
2 minutes of show

I simply mark the beginning and end points of each segment that I want to keep, put them in a clipboard and then join them together into a new file. It works. It's easy. So I am joining segments of
1 minute intro + 10 minutes of show + 10 minutes of show + 2 minutes of show into a new file that will be 25 minutes long. I know it sounds wrong, but trust me, doing it this way is the way to go. I learned this trick many years ago from a guy who investigated at a very detailed level how MPEGVCR worked and he found that only by putting together video in this way, rather than trying to remove unwanted segments from a file, could he avoid sync problems that happened every time if he tried to remove video from a file.

[edsmith77]

poisondeathray,
Thanks for the input and yes I did the quick stream fix. But alas no joy in muddville. My version of VideoReDo is 2.5.6.512 and per their web site this is the most current version.

Jman98,
Thanks for your patience. Just one more question, OK I got the part about marking the segments that I want to keep. Now how do I get them onto the clipboard? Is this as simple as a cut/copy ? Or is this an internal VideoReDo clipboard. If so, then I create a new stream and paste them into that stream. Or do I create (as in your example) 4 different clips and then import them into my editor of choice for merging?

Ed.

[edsmith77]

UPDATE !!
OK so I figured out the difference between frame cut and scene cut and how to get / mark the segments I want and produce a new contiguous file. I did this with a known good dummy file.

Now for the moment of truth using the file with the bad frames.

Everything goes well in the scene mode marking the start and stop points. That is unitl frame 57312 where I get the following error message: "Video Dimension Changed". At this point there is only one way out and that is to kill the app. That leaves me with the only option of restarting and running the Quick Stream Fix. I then ran VideoReDo on that new file and lo and behold, I get the same error message again. This time it is on frame 57627. So I repeat the process again and again until I get no bad sync frames found after the Quick Stream Fix.

So I think I am golden at this point. Ooooops. Still the same error message but at a different frame.

Now I am really stuck. Anyone with different options or refinements?

Ed.

[SmokieStover]

Regarding VideoReDo Plus, Scene mode is the easiest one to use. Scenes are marked with the Sel. Start and the Sel. End buttons. The clip board is labeled "Scene List". Use the Add Selection button to add the scenes (one at a time as they are marked) to the Scene List (clipboard). Aggregate run time of Scenes or clips is shown under Output in the List tabulation.

I never understood why Cut Mode is set by default.....I am always working with files where I know almost exactly how much run time (Output) I can fit to one disk; Scene Mode tells me exactly where I am as the Scenes are accumalated.....if I run a bit over, delete the last Scene, save the project as Part 1 of 2, or 3, or whatever, then output (Save Video As) the edited file as Part 1, 2, 3, or whatever. Then open the project file, add the next Scene, delete all previous scenes, and move on as before.

If a quick stream fix is needed, run it first then edit the output. If that doesn't work, get help from VideoReDo's forum. You will get the attention of the folks who develop the software.

[Lurkin]

Your process is backwards, but it's also intuitive. You need to change your thinking - instead of removing what you don't want, cut and join what you do want. Both VideoReDo and MPEGVCR work much better that way. Don't EXCLUDE anything! Here's an example. Let's say I have a TV capture like this:
1 minute intro
2 minutes commercials
10 minutes of show
2 minutes of commercials
11 minutes of show
2 minutes of commercials
2 minutes of show

I simply mark the beginning and end points of each segment that I want to keep, put them in a clipboard and then join them together into a new file. It works. It's easy. So I am joining segments of
1 minute intro + 10 minutes of show + 10 minutes of show + 2 minutes of show into a new file that will be 25 minutes long. I know it sounds wrong, but trust me, doing it this way is the way to go. I learned this trick many years ago from a guy who investigated at a very detailed level how MPEGVCR worked and he found that only by putting together video in this way, rather than trying to remove unwanted segments from a file, could he avoid sync problems that happened every time if he tried to remove video from a file.

I know this post is over 2 years old now, but I ran into this problem, and I have just over 100 1 hour episodes I am looking to convert from my Tivo and I finally got the QSF issue solved and now I am trying to figure out what exactly jman98 does step by step so I can take the main program portions of the file, cut them, paste them and join them together. Right now I have the file in scene mode with the ad-detective complete and all the commercial parts have been selected, so the main program parts are in red. I am just trying to figure out where I go from here in the manner jman and others suggested.